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| (US) 12/06 - Voter disenfranchisement... |
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Ami Silberman
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Jol
Post Number: 187
Registered: 12-2004
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 11:34 am: | 
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(From Wikipedia) The Comitia Tributa (Tribal Assembly) included both patricians and plebeians distributed among the thirty-five tribes into which all Roman citizens were placed for administrative and electoral purposes. The vast majority of the urban population of Rome was distributed among the four urban tribes, which meant that their votes were individually insignificant. Like the Centuriate Assembly, voting was indirect, with one vote apportioned to each tribe. The voting was therefore heavily slanted in favor of the thirty-one rural tribes.
(As a side note, since you had to vote in person, it was heavily slanted toward either the wealthy or the unemployed in the rurual tribes.) |
Brant Lamb
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Brantl
Post Number: 1084
Registered: 01-2005
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 5:29 am: |
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That's true if there is a purely urban/rural split in all positions on voting, otherwise their votes are just as meaningful as anybody else's. The minority's vote is always meaningless (except as a kind of blackmail) in a majority-wins-all system, what's your point? |
Ami Silberman
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Jol
Post Number: 190
Registered: 12-2004
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 6, 2006 - 3:17 pm: |
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I don't think you understand how the votes are assigned. The 31 rural tribes have about 10,000 members each. The 4 urban tribes have about 100,000 members each. Over half the Roman citizens belong to only four tribes. So, in order to pass legislation, you only need to gain a majority in each of 18 of the 31 urban tribes.
And there was often an urban/rural split, plus the majority of the vested elite belonged to the rural tribes (even though they lived in Rome). The urban tribes were primarily made up from the descendents of foreigners and freedmen. |
Brant Lamb
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Brantl
Post Number: 1105
Registered: 01-2005
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, December 11, 2006 - 5:55 am: |
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Yeah, it was set up like our Senate. Is our Senate 'fair'? No. |
Ami Silberman
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Jol
Post Number: 200
Registered: 12-2004
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, December 11, 2006 - 7:01 am: |
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Our Senate is fair in the sense that:
a) We are a Republic that, at least nominally, has distinct and separate states. In some senses, the House represents the people's very local interests, and the Senate represents the interests of the people in the various States. So I think it is fair. Why should the state of Oklahoma, for example, have less of a voice in the Federal Government, as a State, than the State of New Jersey?
If our Senate was apportioned the way that the Roman Tribal assemblies were, each state existing in 1793 had two Senators, and then all the territory admitted since 1793 would have only eight senators. Or possibly, only people who had a direct male ancestor who was a US Citizen in 1793 could vote for an actual State Senator, everyone who couldn't trace back to such an ancestor could only vote for one of eight "at large" senators. |
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