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| 11-20-06: Black Box Voting receives n... |
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| Author |
Message |
    
Bev Harris
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Site_admin
Post Number: 214
Registered: 10-2006
Best of Black Box? 
Votes: 5 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 9:00 am: | 
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This is the fourth time Black Box Voting and/or its founder, Bev Harris, have received legal threats from voting machine vendors who believe they have the right to sell secret software that miscounts elections.
Attached below is a copy of a peculiar cease and desist order from ES&S, which asks Black Box Voting to remove links that don't exist on its Web site. Black Box Voting does not even have access to the information ES&S is demanding.
ES&S machines have demonstrated proven miscounts in Texas, Florida and Arkansas in the Nov. 2006 election, but exactly how the software miscounted is supposed to be a secret, knowable only to people who work for this privately held company.
Even the county officials, who in some cases have been crying out for assistance -- and are unhappy with the level of service they've received from ES&S and its contractors -- are not permitted to look at the ES&S software that miscounted their votes.
Details on those stories follow, after some additional records are received from Freedom of Information and public records requests to further document those situations. In the mean time, some of the ES&S miscounts can be found through news searches.
Here is a link to the latest ES&S threat letter, which is full of factual inaccuracies:
ES_S_Slashdot-45351.pdfThis is the fourth time Black Box Voting and/or its founder, Bev Harris, have received legal threats from voting machine vendors who believe they have the right to sell secret software that miscounts elections.
Attached below is a copy of a peculiar cease and desist order from ES&S, which asks Black Box Voting to remove links that don't exist on its Web site. Black Box Voting does not even have access to the information ES&S is demanding.
ES&S machines have demonstrated proven miscounts in Texas and Arkansas in the Nov. 2006 election, but exactly how the software miscounted is supposed to be a secret, knowable only to people who work for this privately held company.
Even the county officials, who in some cases have been crying out for assistance -- and are unhappy with the level of service they've received from ES&S and its contractors -- are not permitted to look at the ES&S software that miscounted their votes.
Details on those stories follow, after some additional records are received from Freedom of Information and public records requests to further document those situations. In the mean time, some of the ES&S miscounts can be found through news searches.
Here is a link to the latest ES&S threat letter, which is full of factual inaccuracies:
The files in question have been floating around amoung various voting integrity researchers for more than a year, and Black Box Voting contends that no copyright violation has occurred anyway, as review of these files is clearly in the public interest.
This is what you get when you privatize voting companies. Unlike Diebold, ES&S is privately held and discloses no public information on its owners, which have included Republican Senator Chuck Hagel, his campaign finance director Michael McCarthy, the Omaha World Herald (which controls many of the newspapers in Nebraska and has failed to cover the conflict of interest of its own state senator). Other owners that have been listed, but whose current involvement is not confirmed since ES&S's stock transactions are a secret, are: A consortium of owners of the former Cronus/Business Records Corp. from Texas. This involvement was mentioned in 1997. Also, an entity called "Normal Investments LLC" was listed by ES&S on documents submitted to Santa Clara County, Calif. during a procurement process.
We will refer the cease & desist from ES&S to our Board of Directors. It's hard to know what to do with it, since nothing in the letter appears to address anything Black Box Voting has control over.
PERMISSION TO REPRINT AND DISTRIBUTE THIS ARTICLE IS GRANTED, WITH LINK TO http://www.blackboxvoting.org
The files in question have been floating around amoung various voting integrity researchers for more than a year, and Black Box Voting contends that no copyright violation has occurred anyway, as review of these files is clearly in the public interest.
This is what you get when you privatize voting companies. Unlike Diebold, ES&S is privately held and discloses no public information on its owners, which have included Republican Senator Chuck Hagel, his campaign finance director Michael McCarthy, the Omaha World Herald (which controls many of the newspapers in Nebraska and has failed to cover the conflict of interest of its own state senator). Other owners that have been listed, but whose current involvement is not confirmed since ES&S's stock transactions are a secret, are: A consortium of owners of the former Cronus/Business Records Corp. from Texas. This involvement was mentioned in 1997. Also, an entity called "Normal Investments LLC" was listed by ES&S on documents submitted to Santa Clara County, Calif. during a procurement process.
We will refer the cease & desist from ES&S to our Board of Directors. It's hard to know what to do with it, since nothing in the letter appears to address anything Black Box Voting has control over.
PERMISSION TO REPRINT AND DISTRIBUTE THIS ARTICLE IS GRANTED, WITH LINK TO http://www.blackboxvoting.org |
Bev Harris
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Site_admin
Post Number: 221
Registered: 10-2006
Best of Black Box? 
Votes: 2 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 4:53 pm: |
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Here is the threat letter:
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John C. Ervin
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Muservin
Post Number: 36
Registered: 06-2005
Best of Black Box?
Votes: 1 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 10:41 am: |
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Sen. Hagel and his connections both to ES&S and the Omaha World Herald should be a subject of real concern ( and inquiry ) to all of us, since the Omaha World Herald also enjoys considerable clout through one of its editors who sits on the rather small board of directors of AP. ( I think there are six or seven members, and the lions' share are several editors from Dallas Morning News. At least that was the composition, when last I looked a year or so ago. I lived in Dallas for several years, in the 'Eighties, and had little choice but to get much of my "news" from that publication and a brief glance would convince most people that it is hardly the newspaper of "record" for the United States ~ if nothing else could ~ but which status seems to be implied by its overwhelming influence within AP. )
I'm interested in dot-connections, here. Since Omaha World Herald is on that AP board, and two or three DMN editors, and since OWH has such ties to ES&S, counting 60% of our vote ( !! ) and AP has had a very critical role in exit-polling over the years, we begin to see, ah, conflicts of interest involving this paper, and others. We have, there, people from a paper that has had a key player role in a company that "counts" the majority of American votes, involved with managerial decisions of AP, which has been involved crucially in exit polling for years. Aside from the question of the legitimacy, or legality, of private firms counting our public votes privately (gasp), or exit polls privately, for that matter! ~~ we have a simple matter of conflict of interest. How, in the public trust, can corporations of this kind be allowed to have such business involvement? It would seem that any decent court system would let anyone give THEM cease and desist orders, and uphold them, to at least get out of the exit-pollig business, Newz (propaganda) biz, or BOTH. And yet such double-barreled assault ( or triple, counting the voting companies themselves ) against the public interest is allowed. Could it be because Congress has been stacked with "representatives" who were put there by fraudulent, rigged voting? Or that they were elected for the express purpose of gutting our laws that protect voting ??
It would have to seem so, judging past results. I know, since I read this information about AP's board, etc., that some of the terrain may have changed, and I believe some has. But, whether now or then, these roots and connections between press and private vote-counting, and private exit-polling, continue to fester, whether it be at VoterNewsService, disbanded in 2002, or NEP, or any of the other unholy alliances, which have mostly switched hats in recent years. If you study the close relationship between Tillman Durdin of NYT in the early '50s, and the CIA, we can see that the very pernicious involvement of US based terrorist activity is closely aided and abetted by some of our news organizations. It's a tangled web they weave, amongst themselves, and we must assume that all of these groups maintain players' rosters that continue to complicate the picture of voting, and ever "practice to deceive." And that is why we are always compelled to completely circumvent media channels in bringing this most important story to the public's attention. ES&S has become, to my mind, a stand-in for Big Brother, if you consider how many of its fingers are in so many pies. It is probably the one institution that most needs to be relentlessly investigated ( and exposed ). ES&S, and Robert Gates, whom Bev has reported has the most suspicious ties to private voting oversight and direction. |
Bev Harris
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Site_admin
Post Number: 217
Registered: 10-2006
Best of Black Box?
Votes: 2 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 11:02 am: |
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Interesting information. The biggest voting machine company in America, up until 1997, was Texas-based BRC (bought by ES&S), which was owned by a bunch of Dallas-ites and other Texans. There is also an interesting coincidence -- Enron, a company most people think is Texan, actually originated in Omaha. That's off-topic, of course.
ES&S has 145 of Texas's 255 counties, all but three counties in Arkansas, all counties in North and South Carolina, almost all counties in Nebraska and Oklahoma, and it is a giant, very secretive organization that reportedly likes to blame its customers for known issues in its own product.
(Message edited by site_admin on November 20, 2006) |
Russell Novkov
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Rnovkov
Post Number: 150
Registered: 02-2006
Best of Black Box? 
Votes: 1 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 3:02 pm: |
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I would like to see E & S run out of business.
Russell J. Novkov
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Jed Vankrieken
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Piggy
Post Number: 7
Registered: 11-2006
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 3:05 pm: |
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"Tarrant County had a license to use certain software modules in its election in 2001" - This is interesting because the 2001 software was also used for 2002, 2003 & 2004. This can easily be proven.
Based on what i've seen. The computer that this software came from. Was (in total) used from 1998-2005. Additionally, It had been actively used during the time period of 2001-05 with the use of the 2001 application.
The machine this software & stored data came from. Had been one, more, or all of the following:
1. Passed around
2. Sat in an insecure office
3. Used for repeated successfull & failed testing over a period of years.
4. Used for at least 15 different elections spanning from late 98-04. Not factoring data that had been inactive for years prior to 98'
Based on my expertise. It is very likely this software was released by a current or prior Tarrant County or ES&S employee for the following reasons:
1. The size of the data & the time & effort it would've taken to transfer on the majority of mediums.
2. The amount of time & effort it would've taken to organize & compress the data.
3. The precision & preservation of which data was included.
4. The first hand knowledge of all applications, application data paths & the additional paths non-active data was stored outside of known & in use application paths. Including but not limited to non-default storage & installation paths.
5. Evidence some data was copied from a multitude of original disks.
6. The timeline of all non-application election data which is roughly 10 years.
Additionally, there is at least 5 contained 3rd party applications. That are not registered (shareware). And not meant for commercial use. That i have reason to believe were used by ES&S & Tarrant County officials given the structure of how some dated software was stored, transferred and installed.
Lastly, there should be further investigation into at least two 3rd party applications used for an installation medium, regarding absolute-proper commercial use.
If it is such the case that a Tarrant County or ES&S employee had not directly released this. The next likely scenerio is a Tarrant County or ES&S employee intentionally setup a position for which it could be 'stolen'. What has been found here is by no means a coincidence. Nor done by an unknown person.
If i was in ES&S's legal position. I would be giving consideration into the minimal weight of success vs the inevitable cost & future failure of proceeding further. Whether it be in the media or in court. You cannot remove what has already been done and will be done in the future. This would be referred to as 'damage control'.
I would assume it is in ES&S's best interest to prevent further damage. ES&S will not get satisfaction, or any gain (we're poor?) from persuing citizens. ES&S will only and exclusively make things worse for themselves. This is a fact.
By stating this i am not at all 'challenging' ES&S. I am giving you a very honest opinion. I have been extremely careful to not have a biased position against ES&S and other vendors. It has been documented where i have come to ES&S's & other vendors defense when positions lack actual likely proof. Simply put, i have no real political agenda. You will not find any radical or 'tin foil' posts by me here for a reason. Much like many here i just seek the truth.
(Message edited by PiGGY on November 20, 2006) |
Bruce Sims
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Ubetchaiam
Post Number: 920
Registered: 06-2005
Best of Black Box?
Votes: 2 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 3:17 pm: |
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FWIW; please compare the Board of Directors of Associated Press (a "non-profit" enterprise)
http://www.ap.org/pages/about/board.html
with the make up of who owns the 'free press' in this country:
http://www.freepress.net/ownership/chart.php?chart=pub
'Nuf said(not really but I'd be ranting again). |
Bev Harris
Board Administrator
Username: Admin
Post Number: 5829
Registered: 12-2004
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 3:38 pm: |
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Jed,
Thanks for the insights. I still have not had a chance to look at the files at all, but have gotten concurrence from several with inside and outside access that things are not swell with ES&S.
If ES&S would like to join me in discovery I have some of their own who have already prepped Black Box Voting with very specific questions about defects in their software -- which ES&S knew about but failed to admit, and instead blamed them on the customer. There are specific locations. As far as I know, each location doesn't know about the other.
They will soon.
I have Freedom of Information requests on the desks of election administrators in two hundred and ninety-one ES&S locations and I haven't really gotten started. I wanted to wait until some of ES&S's post-election spastications had begun to die down, but it doesn't look like that will happen any time soon, so the FOIAs have started going out anyway.
GET BEHIND HB 6200. Requires public hand-counting of ballots for the 2008 presidential race, at the precinct, before the ballots leave the polling place.
(Say no to HR 550. It's dangerous.)
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Catherine Ansbro
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Catherine_a
Post Number: 3486
Registered: 12-2004
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 3:57 pm: |
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Thanks for those links, Bruce. Very revealing to see the "big boys" tucked away amongst the media from folksy-sounding locations.
Rant away. |
Bev Harris
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Site_admin
Post Number: 220
Registered: 10-2006
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 4:48 pm: |
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I think Lee Enterprises has the Lincoln Nebraska newspaper, one of the few holdouts in Nebraska that wasn't bought by the Omaha World Herald. I am saying that from memory of something I looked up three years ago, and we all know I can misremember now and then.
Didn't see Omaha World Herald in those lists. I do agree with Brad Friedman about one thing -- they should divest of their interest in ES&S.
When I looked into it, Omaha World Herald owned about one-third of ES&S and McCarthy Group another third -- but then it turns out that an Omaha World Herald subsidiary owns a chunk of McCarthy Group. So for the World Companies/Omaha World Herald to divest, they'd have to also divest themselves of McCarthy Group. |
Steve Armstrong
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Starmstr
Post Number: 12
Registered: 03-2006
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 11:22 am: |
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How did we end up in an America in which having the people who own the media/free press (aka partisan press) also own the voting machines and some even have seats in Congress?
Not only can they tie up BBV legally, but they can work to shape and rally public opinion as well, and have reprentation willing to try to rewrite the state or federal laws until BBV gets sunk.
This is a monster opportunity for essential election reform. Can we get the newly elected Dems to focus on this terrible failure to separate power? |
Mac Hathaway
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Mac_hathaway
Post Number: 63
Registered: 08-2005
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 3:42 pm: |
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Hey Gang!
Well, Steve, I would say YES. Bev has posted suggestions about how we can go about spreading the word about the problems with electronic voting, but it's worth reiterating (and perhaps sending a BBV Action Alert), with this new Congress coming in, that we should all call our Congress-folk and ask them to fix this FIRST. Ask them, before they do ANYTHING else, to support HB 6200. (Requires public hand-counting of ballots for the 2008 presidential race, at the precinct, before the ballots leave the polling place, as Bev's postscript indicates).
Additional legislation could call for:
Non-partisan Secretaries of State, election heads and staff
Non-partisan redistricting commissions
Other things which I can't think of at the moment...
Perhaps we can compile a list of all the NEWLY elected folks, and contact them BEFORE Christmas/January, to get their heads into this before they get buried with all the ongoing stuff.
What do you think, Bev? A very targeted, short-term action?
Also, you may want to edit the first post in this thread, as it it looks like it double-posted some stuff...
Mac |
Gerry Peters
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Gerry_peters
Post Number: 1
Registered: 11-2006
Best of Black Box?
Votes: 1 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 6:33 pm: |
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I'm appalled at the arrogance of ES&S, the Media needs to be covering this story, maybe having people send lots of emails of outrage to the Media on what's ES&S is doing will force them to cover this. There are plenty of groups very concerned with Election Fraud that would probably be willing to get involved emailing people to sign petitions, email the media or Congressmen and blogging about these atrocities and this ridiculous cease and desist order. These means are very powerful at mobilizing people.
Now that the Dems are in, we've got to get them to clean up this huge threat to Democracy with these easy manipulatable hackable and lamely made machines. It's no time for complacency. Sure there's conflicts of interest making the Media not want to expose some of this, but in this day and age of informative emails and Blogs, we can nail the Corporate Media and make them behave when then there's a big enough public outroar.
Just because the Dems won sure doesn't mean the problems aren't as bad as we thought. Personally I think the "powers that be" decided it was time the Dems got in and if they wanted the Repubs still in, I think there would have been more blatant cheating and manipulating.
Or maybe there were enough people monitoring the voting machines because of the Media attention like Lou Dobbs and Keith Olbermann and all the Bloggs, email lists, voting organizations,etc that have raised public awareness of this to the point that the cheaters were afraid of stealing this election.. Or maybe they just didn't steal enough votes. I wish I really knew the answer to this mystery, I can only speculate..
Regardless of how the Dems got in, there are still totally botched Elections like the Sarasota that should be really be redone with paper ballots and optical scanners. I think the only way this whole problem will be fixed is for the people to rise up like we're doing and demand it from our Elected Leaders. If we lived in a just world traitors like ES&S and Diebold would be tarred and feathered and driven out of town. Keep up the great work, Bev, you're a true American hero. |
Bev Harris
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Site_admin
Post Number: 228
Registered: 10-2006
Best of Black Box?
Votes: 2 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 7:06 pm: |
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Oh, believe me I'm seeing some evidence of Dems misbehaving on Nov. 7.
Dems are interested in Dems winning. Not necessarily investigating anything to do with voting machines. And look how quickly Sarasota turned into a "ballot design" issue.
Well that sure doesn't explain the reports where people repeatedly touched Jennings and repeatedly got a blank confirm screen.
I say, hold all their toes to the fire. |
Jim Enright
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Jimkevin
Post Number: 1
Registered: 11-2006
Best of Black Box?
Votes: 1 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 3:42 pm: |
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I wonder if the lawyers for ES&S are assuming that www.blackbox1.org is run by the same people as BlackboxVoting.org?
The files in their threatening letter are still at that site, and can be downloaded quite easily.
What's really funny is that in their foolish attempt to stop Blackbox from propogating this info, they are propogating it even more.
Does anyone know - is it really illegal to download these files? Even if one doesn't re-send or sell them? And shouldn't they be expected to put some protection on these files, if they think they can claim some rights under copyright law?
Let's all go download those files just to piss them off! |
John C. Ervin
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Muservin
Post Number: 37
Registered: 06-2005
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 8:54 pm: |
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Fascinating, if by now a bit dizzying, just all the many dots we have to connect, truly "an embarrassment of riches," especially in Texas. What a shock in recognition I get when you say that Enron has Omaha ties. I mean, Omaha is not exactly the center of culture for the country, or business, and yet you find all this involvement. I recently saw, and gasped aplenty, breath taken from me in large gulps, the DVD "Enron: The Smartest Guys in the Room." What I found especially riveting was that Chase, Merrill Lynch, Deutsche Banke in Germany, and just about every high profile investment put all their stock and credo in Enron ~~ ALL WHILE KNOWING THEY DIDN'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO SEE THEIR BOOKS."
This is amazing to me, how business is now conducted this way. One of my neighbors, John Hueston, took Lay down on all counts, and we hope his valiant, salient, lawyering will be a watershed in stopping this kind of thing. But you'd think that Hagel and ES&S had much to learn at his knee. Skilling sold it all to them, without opening his books, as "Hypothetical Future Value." In short, he went to the bank with money that had not been made. Nor ever was.
When I was first on Jim Hogue's show, we chatted for a few minutes on the phone before hand, and I told him that just what I'd seen of business actions and money changing hands in Texas was so dizzying, and unchecked or unmoderated, that one's ability to connect dots on the graph were thwarted by the entire grid having turned to black, by all dots merging together into one field. He thought that was a compelling image, and asked me to repeat that on air, which got lost in the rush of excitement about other revelations on Hart InterCivic and the
tangled web they weave.
But such a covert business setup as ES&S has going has got to be something that can be exposed, by default of this big black dot, this merging of all their frauds into one big "cluster"
and they are making our job easier.
Thanks for this info, and I'm now armed with a lot more info about these Texas to OWH connections which I intend to follow up.
Peace: John E |
Bradley Spencer
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Brad_spencer
Post Number: 113
Registered: 11-2006
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Thursday, November 23, 2006 - 4:47 pm: |
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Bev
I read the threat letter you posted.
Do you think it would have been possible for ES&S to have found a law firm with a few more partners and lawyers on the board ??
The list is longer than their wording to you !
As a bunch of knuckle head, blood sucking, mind numbing lawyers, they should know by now that size isnt everything !!
Dont be intimidated by ass holes with credentials longer than their names.
I'm guessing that the person who designed the firms letterhead was probably a man, and as a small child he was bullied and teased at school.
Its my opinion that law firms of this size that generaly the left hand doesnt know what the right hand is doing.
Its like "look at how big and impressive we are" and then "Oh, by the way, we're a Limited Liability Organisation so we can all run and hide if we screw up !"
 smile Bev....you are obviously doing something right....keep on doing it !
Best regards
Brad |
Gerry Peters
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Gerry_peters
Post Number: 2
Registered: 11-2006
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Friday, November 24, 2006 - 2:32 pm: |
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>>Oh, believe me I'm seeing some evidence of Dems misbehaving on Nov. 7.
Dems are interested in Dems winning.<<
No doubt. It brings us back to the old line of Stalin, all that matters is "who" counts the votes. The Dems have rightly been outraged at 2, which I believe were stolen Presidential Elections and I'm sure many other races. I just hope the leadership has been outraged enough to fix this monumental threat to Democracy.
I feel like John Conyers and a few other will really try their best to fix this and I just hope the rest of the Dems awaken from their slumber on this "real" not "conpiracy theory" issue. I'm expecting to get plenty of email petitions and emails to Congressmen and such and look forward to signing every one of them trying to get this fixed. Emails and Blogs have the potential of giving the Government back to the people.
I've been telling Repubs for a long time that it's in their interest to get this fixed also and all of a sudden they're starting to get interested in fixing this. Now that the Dems are responsible for counting most of the Nation's votes, they're interested. I can't blame them for getting nervous. It's more than partisan Repubs owning voting machine companies, it's also about easily hackable machines, hackable by Dems or Repubs.
I live in Nashville and lived for many years in Memphis and read about the Shelby County problem with PC-Anywhere installed on a Diebold central tabulator. Although at first I thought the Repubs were trying to steal the Election, I later wondered whether the Dems were. Since Memphis is now mostly Black and Democratic, why couldn't they be doing the manipulating. I noticed that some Republican Party people were very concerned when the voting cards were missing in Memphis. The race between Harold Ford and Bob Corker could have been won by the most skillful hacker. We'll probably never really know.
The Dems have a real opportunity to stay in power a long time by firstly focusing on the needs of the people instead of the Corporations and also by fixing this badly broken Electoral system, so the will of the people will be respected. I plan on doing my part. |
Catherine Ansbro
Frequent Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Catherine_a
Post Number: 3507
Registered: 12-2004
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Friday, November 24, 2006 - 2:59 pm: |
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Hi Gerry, I really appreciate the points you made in your post.
This has got to be tackled from a non-partisan perspective. You're right that recent Democratic advances are helping more Republicans to see the potential problems--problems they didn't see before.
Welcome to BBV. |
Gerry Peters
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Gerry_peters
Post Number: 3
Registered: 11-2006
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Friday, November 24, 2006 - 4:40 pm: |
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>>Hi Gerry, I really appreciate the points you made in your post.
This has got to be tackled from a non-partisan perspective. You're right that recent Democratic advances are helping more Republicans to see the potential problems--problems they didn't see before.
Welcome to BBV.<<
Thanks, Catherine. I've followed BBV for 6 years, since the 2000 Election debacle. Although I'm new to this forum I've read many articles from this site and have had great appreciation for Bev and BBV for years and was glad to see her in action on the HBO special "Hacking Democracy".
This is an exciting time for us now that we have hope of fixing this with the Dems in, but like Bev said we have to hold their feet to the fire or they'll get complacent and over-confident. I've been extremley worried about his issue since 2000, because I felt there was a possiblity through Election fraud we could have a one-party government, which we know too well was Karl Rove's plan using a variety of means.
I have no idea if he or any high up Repubs were actively involved in the Election fraud. I wish I knew, but I know they sanctioned all sorts of dirty tricks for disenfranchisement. It would be disasterous to have a one-party system, whether it was the Dems or Repubs. At that point you might as well have a dictatorship.
Oversight seems to be the only way to combat corruption and all sorts of governmental atocities. We've had virtually no Congressional oversight for 6 years and little Media oversight. Thank God the oversight will begin again with the new Democratic House and Senate and of course the Media will enjoy the frenzy.
BBV and other great grass root organizations are shedding light on cozy Corporate relationships like ES&S with politicians and Media companies. We need to break this Corporate stranglehold on the policies of the US. Sometimes I feel we have a kinship with the American Patriots during our Revolutionary War breaking free the unjust yoke Britain had on our Nation. I'm so glad our weapons are the pen and the typewriter. That kind of War I don't mind being a part of. |
Jeffrey Ortiz
Voting Rights Forum Participant
Username: Jeffjortiz
Post Number: 4
Registered: 11-2006
Best of Black Box? N/A
Votes: 0 (A keeper?) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 13, 2006 - 7:34 pm: |
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Did Black Box Voting file a Freedom Of Information request with the Jefferson County, TX Clerks office for certain documents regarding this past Novembers election. It was mentioned to me that Black Box has suggested there may have been major fraud or break down of the electronic voting machines in Jefferson County, TX.
Please let me know via email at jeff@jeffortiz.com
thanks
JEFF |
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ES&S latest threat letter
